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Gatland's replacement. 
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
AverageBBCjournalist wrote:
I may be out on my own here but I don’t really have much of an issue with Phillips. Admittedly Davies was an odd appointment

The wales job post World Cup will be an exciting post for someone. Also gatland is very high profile which in turn makes filling his boots of interest


What has Phillips done since appointed, other than throw money at Newport?

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Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:38 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Langland Exile wrote:
AverageBBCjournalist wrote:
I may be out on my own here but I don’t really have much of an issue with Phillips. Admittedly Davies was an odd appointment

The wales job post World Cup will be an exciting post for someone. Also gatland is very high profile which in turn makes filling his boots of interest


What has Phillips done since appointed, other than throw money at Newport?


That’s enough for me


Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:43 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
On the plus side he has just kept the same policies Lewis implemented in place on the whole , not so daft after all.

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Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:15 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Fergie picked his successor, Moyes, that didn't work out very well.


Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:50 am
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
jimcardiff wrote:
On the plus side he has just kept the same policies Lewis implemented in place on the whole , not so daft after all.


To change anything would mean making a decision and being accountable?

I have never heard any real policy or strategy words from his mouth in 2 years...they don't teach that at Harvard.. ;)

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Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:26 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
The Abominable Dr. Phibes wrote:
Who would you like to see?

I hope Pivac gets it, he's been in Wales a while now, so he knows the scene here, he would be the best choice IMO, I like the way his team plays, he would do well with Wales.

We need a complete clear out, none of the current set up should remain, only 18 months to go.


6,000th post....trumpets, fanfare, slow fart....Dai Young from 'The Wasp Factory'. He's not in the book but put your house on it.

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Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:03 am
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?

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Fri Mar 23, 2018 11:43 am
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.

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Fri Mar 23, 2018 1:03 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.


You seem to be arguing 'chief exec', whereas I (and I think others) are saying something along the lines of 'advisor'. I completely agree he shouldn't be a chief exec. But I maintain that there is a significant overlap between the problems that Gatland encounters and his view on Welsh rugby, and how to fix them - which is the role of a chief exec. Few people in Welsh rugby are more informed on the subject.


Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:51 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Cymru am byth wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.


You seem to be arguing 'chief exec', whereas I (and I think others) are saying something along the lines of 'advisor'. I completely agree he shouldn't be a chief exec. But I maintain that there is a significant overlap between the problems that Gatland encounters and his view on Welsh rugby, and how to fix them - which is the role of a chief exec. Few people in Welsh rugby are more informed on the subject.


Otto did mention Chief Exec snd that role has definition.

I do take your point and that was the other side of the role eg advisor in parallel to the new appointee that was formally mentioned in the WRU quote...1 year was mentioned?

There have already been comments on that and I fall on the side of a new Coach should be aware of direct circumstances but that there is a danger of too much continuity when new ideas and approach might be the name of the game.

Otto extrapolated that into Gatland being a potential Chief Exec, he also said that he thought many wouldnt agree with him, I was one...

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Fri Mar 23, 2018 3:46 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Tony Panties wrote:
Cymru am byth wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.


You seem to be arguing 'chief exec', whereas I (and I think others) are saying something along the lines of 'advisor'. I completely agree he shouldn't be a chief exec. But I maintain that there is a significant overlap between the problems that Gatland encounters and his view on Welsh rugby, and how to fix them - which is the role of a chief exec. Few people in Welsh rugby are more informed on the subject.


Otto did mention Chief Exec snd that role has definition.

I do take your point and that was the other side of the role eg advisor in parallel to the new appointee that was formally mentioned in the WRU quote...1 year was mentioned?

There have already been comments on that and I fall on the side of a new Coach should be aware of direct circumstances but that there is a danger of too much continuity when new ideas and approach might be the name of the game.

Otto extrapolated that into Gatland being a potential Chief Exec, he also said that he thought many wouldnt agree with him, I was one...


Granted. I take your point too. Hugs for everyone!


Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:13 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Tony Panties wrote:
Cymru am byth wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.


You seem to be arguing 'chief exec', whereas I (and I think others) are saying something along the lines of 'advisor'. I completely agree he shouldn't be a chief exec. But I maintain that there is a significant overlap between the problems that Gatland encounters and his view on Welsh rugby, and how to fix them - which is the role of a chief exec. Few people in Welsh rugby are more informed on the subject.


Otto did mention Chief Exec snd that role has definition.

I do take your point and that was the other side of the role eg advisor in parallel to the new appointee that was formally mentioned in the WRU quote...1 year was mentioned?

There have already been comments on that and I fall on the side of a new Coach should be aware of direct circumstances but that there is a danger of too much continuity when new ideas and approach might be the name of the game.

Otto extrapolated that into Gatland being a potential Chief Exec, he also said that he thought many wouldnt agree with him, I was one...


Tel, I don't think you read what I said? I said; I suspect he could have made which in no way links him with (a) Sacking Phillips and (b) Appointing Gatland?
I then simply suggested that a man with his immense experience could be a wonderful acquisition in an elite player position, a la Lewsey (who had zero experience in coaching, let alone personnel and man management) who failed in what was deemed a crucial position? Simple as really? It would have been easier to answer my point rather than create your own and answer that!!

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Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:28 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Cymru am byth wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
Otto wrote:
Nobody will agree with me I suspect but I'd like to see Gatland retained by the WRU in some position? I'd suspect he could have made a good Chief Exec. but, with the Davies/Phillips regime seemingly cemented on, that's not possible! He has to be the most experienced International coach on the planet and, that's a huge chunk of knowledge and experience to set aside? What bothers me, is that almost every 'elite' appointment in the past years, have all vanished as quickly as they came (Lewsy et al?) I'm sure Gatland could make something of that element?
One question I'd still love an answer to (though it matters little I suppose?) is why, Sean Edwards was Gatlands sole pick for his coaching team? That appeared to me, one of the most weird things about Gatlands contracts since he was appointed? Edwards apart, there is absolutely zero succession process in place! (Unless we agree that either/or McBryde and Howley are first choices to replace him?)


I couldn't disagree more.

Coaching is his metier and not Business.


You an expert HR specialist nowadays Tel as well? Your brief reply indicates you don't consider anyone who is just a coach to be a man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual? 'Just a job' as a coach in a multi £million environment qualifies you for nothing else? Where in hell did you work?


Otto, Gatland qualified as a teacher, became a rugby player and subsequently a very experienced Coach.

What makes you think he could suddenly become an effective Chief Exec with very little experience in that essentially different role and late on his career? I'm sure that there are maybe examples out there but it would be tenuous.

As for your other 'qualifications' "... man manager or maybe a forward-looking individual" although attributes they hardly provide overall convincing qualities to be a comprehensive Chief Exec?

Wadr Otto I think that it is, at least, a very ambitious outlook.


You seem to be arguing 'chief exec', whereas I (and I think others) are saying something along the lines of 'advisor'. I completely agree he shouldn't be a chief exec. But I maintain that there is a significant overlap between the problems that Gatland encounters and his view on Welsh rugby, and how to fix them - which is the role of a chief exec. Few people in Welsh rugby are more informed on the subject.


Otto did mention Chief Exec snd that role has definition.

I do take your point and that was the other side of the role eg advisor in parallel to the new appointee that was formally mentioned in the WRU quote...1 year was mentioned?

There have already been comments on that and I fall on the side of a new Coach should be aware of direct circumstances but that there is a danger of too much continuity when new ideas and approach might be the name of the game.

Otto extrapolated that into Gatland being a potential Chief Exec, he also said that he thought many wouldnt agree with him, I was one...


Tel, I don't think you read what I said? I said; I suspect he could have made which in no way links him with (a) Sacking Phillips and (b) Appointing Gatland?
I then simply suggested that a man with his immense experience could be a wonderful acquisition in an elite player position, a la Lewsey (who had zero experience in coaching, let alone personnel and man management) who failed in what was deemed a crucial position? Simple as really? It would have been easier to answer my point rather than create your own and answer that!!


I didn't suggest sacking anybody .. I commented on Gatlands background and experience that was , imo, no way akin toi that of a CEO.



Lewsey, a very different kettle of fish who, imo, failed to stick in any position long enough and had many aspirations including climbing Everest. However his background was essentially different.

Conveniently a quote from Wiki .... chalk and cheese ...

Lewsey pursued interests outside rugby. In 2005 he completed his Postgraduate diploma in Law. He also set up a leadership development and business consultancy, which looked to apply organisational performance lessons from sport and the military, into business.

Lewsey released his autobiography on 5 February 2009 titled One Chance: My Life and Rugby. While rugby heavily featured in his book, he also discussed more personal aspects of his life and general views on issues such as the countryside and importance of sports in communities.

In 2009 he joined PwC as a management consultant, where he led various strategic change projects for a number of clients in different industries.

In September 2011, Lewsey joined Citigroup Global Markets Ltd. as an equities sales trader.[11] After a year in the role he undertook a review of the division’s structural trading model, and was subsequently offered the role of Head of Business Advisory Services, EMEA.
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In March 2013 having spent several years outside the world of sport, he took up a six-month position as Interim CEO at the Cornish Pirates. During his time there, Lewsey pressed the need for the club to “represent its community” and “harness the power of the identity of Cornwall”.

On 30 August 2013, Lewsey was appointed Head of Rugby at the Welsh Rugby Union.[12] After a comprehensive review, Lewsey embarked on a new strategy for the organisation of which a key initiative was support for the grassroots game, establishing School-Club Hubs to safeguard the future of rugby in Wales. By September 2014, the WRU had 43 schools participating in the scheme. By the second year, demand was so great, it had increased to 93, which equated to most secondary schools in Wales, meaning it became one of the largest national sporting programmes ever in the UK.[citation needed] He resigned in November 2015, citing personal reasons which would prevent him from dedicating himself to the position full-time.[13]

--------------------------------------------------------

PS ..." You said failed in what was deemed a crucial position"

At the time people on here were of the opinion that he left after Lewis departure due to lack of faith in WRU futures thereafter. For the record I didn't agree and thought that he was just a wanderlust ... which his cv does support?

So Otto we disagree, not unusual ... ;)

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Fri Mar 23, 2018 7:50 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Only one name comes to me & that's Dai Young.


Thu Mar 29, 2018 5:52 pm
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Post Re: Gatland's replacement.
Old Fart wrote:
Only one name comes to me & that's Dai Young.

That's 2 :kermit: :kermit: :kermit:

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Thu Mar 29, 2018 5:54 pm
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