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Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks 
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Post Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
READ THE PREAMBLE.

http://www.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/story/182286.html

Pulver says the concept will allow Australia's Super Rugby franchises each to expand their playing roster to "45 or 50" players, as has been requested by team coaches and management, and matches would be played as curtain raisers ahead of Super Rugby derby fixtures.

"What this would do is that you use the infrastructure of the Super Rugby franchises," Pulver told ESPNscrum. "The grounds are already paid for. They are actually paid for from 5pm, when you open the gates. So no more costs there. Most of the Super Rugby franchises have already got four coaches. And you'd only have two travel teams each week. Travel is probably going to be the most significant cost. Player payments will have to be managed carefully."

The radical part of Pulver's proposal is his concept of "a one-hour game of rugby" featuring two specific law changes "designed at creating a frenetic-paced game based around smart running rugby".

"You can't have a 40-10-40-minute footy game as a curtain raiser and expect people to turn up at 5pm. They won't. They never have. We want to create an environment, which on the one hand exposes young talent to the Australian rugby public; and maybe do that through a draft, so you distribute that talent around the franchises, but it also focuses its energies on displaying smart, creative rugby. It is a case of where we have listened to the complaints about stoppages, and the frustration of the game. So here's a unique brand of the game where we kick off at 6pm and be over by 7pm.

"In the ideal world I would love two rule changes, and I have to work through this with the IRB. It would be 25-minute halves, no penalty goals, and five-minute yellow cards for infringements in your own half. The yellow card will be a bit like water polo; the rule I love in water polo is that if you infringe when they are attacking your goal, you are out of the pool until they score. Great rule. Our equivalent would be, in a 25-minute game; an infringing player is off the field for five minutes or until the opposition scores."

Pulver says broadcast executives have shown "interest in it" as "we look to relaunch rugby" in Australia, but he does accept that his proposal has a number of obstacles to cross even apart from the IRB's involvement in the suggested law changes.

"The tricky bit is that you don't want to … kill Premier Rugby," Pulver said of Australia's club rugby scene. "So we are looking at positioning this at the front end of the Super Rugby competition and that it complements club rugby, while potentially linking into Sevens programs. Club rugby starts in April. We might defer club rugby, so that it starts in May - and have this development competition going through until May. Then the players would go to club rugby."

Pulver also accepts that "there must be a concern that if you are using this as a developmental process, what is the point of them playing a different game?"

"We are trying to satisfy multiple objectives here," he said. "The public is frustrated with stoppages in the game, so this is a very obvious attempt to show an effect to address that. It is also teaching the kids the skills required to play smart, creative rugby running. You'll have scrums, lineouts, and you are basically preparing them for Super Rugby, but there are a couple of compromises, which will add some excitement to the game."


Tue May 07, 2013 8:29 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Its an interesting idea and could be fun to watch, a bit like T20 cricket.

If you're going to have a fast paced short games, then maybe it would be worth having less than 15 a side, maybe 10 or 13?

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Tue May 07, 2013 4:49 pm
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
deludedgenius wrote:
Its an interesting idea and could be fun to watch, a bit like T20 cricket.

If you're going to have a fast paced short games, then maybe it would be worth having less than 15 a side, maybe 10 or 13?


How about...ooh, i don't know, 7 a side? And shorten the game even further? They could have 3 or 4 games before the big match. Its a wonder no-one thought of it before!


Tue May 07, 2013 8:23 pm
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
let's make everything over in 20 minutes as people have the attention span of gnats? :D


CarmarthenLad wrote:
deludedgenius wrote:
Its an interesting idea and could be fun to watch, a bit l T20 cricket.
If you're going to have a fast paced short games, then maybe it would be worth having less than 15 a side, maybe 10 or 13?


How about...ooh, i don't know, 7 a side? And shorten the game even further? They could have 3 or 4 games before the big match. Its a wonder no-one thought of it before!

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Tue May 07, 2013 8:33 pm
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Why didn't they just suggest dropping the two loosies and introducing a 6 tackle rule if they want a virtual non stop game with everyone handling the ball, good defence and attack and some big hits?

The punters love it

see: http://www.rabbitohs.com.au/

On the home page here there is a bloke that could play any position save probably the front row for Wales.


Tue May 07, 2013 10:38 pm
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Rugby Australia look to be driving rugby union forward to August 1895.


Wed May 08, 2013 6:37 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
If that's what you call seeking for ideas to build market support by introducing crowd pleasing law changes.
Well done for trying.

Personally I'm not particularly struck by them, but then comparing local football fan numbers average each week with regional rugby indicates you may have a similar problem.

Without effort and producing a game people want to watch its going to die.


Wed May 08, 2013 6:55 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Not in Wales.

It's just withered a bit thanks to Moffett.

Where is he from?


Wed May 08, 2013 6:57 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Australia, why?

Not his fault a decent game of rugby rarely breaks out.


Wed May 08, 2013 6:59 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Born in UK - lengthy time in waste management.

Well qualified for subsequent ranking roles.


Wed May 08, 2013 7:03 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
I've never seen a good one ...


SH referee, that is. They tend to perform well at club level and then fade away under pressure in the international arenas of the world.

Colin Hawke, Paddy O'Brien, Lyndon Bray, Bryce Lawrence ..... all disgraced themselves when they reverted to type


Canterbury versus the Lions in 1971 set the benchmark. "Sort it out amongst yourselves", whimpered the home referee.

Fair play to Canterbury after that horror show, which they lost 9-14, they pulled themselves together and have played the game in a different spirit since that ignominy. Which is good.

Canterbury v Lions 1971

The Lions were cutting a swathe through New Zealand ahead of the Test series, and something had to be 'done' to slow their progress before the first Test. Cue one of the bloodiest, most premeditated assaults in rugby history from Canterbury which resulted in Scottish prop Sandy Carmichael, Irish prop Ray McLoughlin and Irish No 8 Mick Hipwell being invalided off the tour, as well as leaving Irish flanker Fergus Slattery with concussion and without two teeth.

Referee John Pring of New Zealand refereed the 4 Test matches and refereed them well, which was very satisfying to watch.


Wed May 08, 2013 7:23 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
The 71 Lions ranked right up there as right royal thugs.

Quote:
Battling the Lions: The battle of Lancaster Park
By John Brooks

It must surely rank among the most extraordinary and potentially inflammatory statements made by a national rugby coach.

After the ill-tempered game between the 1971 Lions and Canterbury at Lancaster Park, Ivan Vodanovich, chairman of selectors and coach of the All Blacks that year, warned the first test could develop into "another Passchendaele" for the tourists if they persisted in killing the ball in rucks and obstructing in the line-out.
His comments came after the Lions had beaten Canterbury 14-3 but had lost their two best props, Ray McLoughlin and Sandy Carmichael, through injury.

Carmichael sustained a multiple fracture of his left cheekbone and McLoughlin a chipped bone at the base of his left thumb. Both returned to Britain for treatment and recuperation.

McLoughlin’s loss was a serious blow to the Lions. He was not only powerfully built and vastly experienced but also a renowned tactician as befitting a man with the IQ of a genius.

It was a tribute to the tourists that they were able to win the series despite his loss.

In the 1966 game between Canterbury and the Lions, violence erupted in the first scrum. It had been rumoured that Howard Norris, a Welsh prop, had backed himself to knock an opposing forward off the pitch.

In the event, it was fortunate that it was not he who was carted off.

Fast forward to 1971, and we have Carmichael persistently boring in on Tane Norton, the Canterbury hooker, blocking his view of the ball entering the tunnel and, therefore, his heel.

Carmichael was warned twice by Alister Hopkinson, the opposing prop, but continued to infringe. He was punched more than once for his trouble.

Although the pudgy prop was in pain from his injuries, sources close to the Lions claimed that he was even more aggrieved to be called "a whinging Pom" by some louts on the embankment. He was proud of being Scottish.

McLoughlin was injured when players from both sides were flailing at each other near the embankment touchline.

The Irishman suffered a rush of blood to the head and punched non-combatant Wyllie in the head, breaking his left thumb. He merely proved what was widely known in Canterbury: that Grizz had a hard cranium.

Another Irishman, Fergus Slattery, was punched in the face after unwisely hanging on to Wyllie’s jersey in a line-out. There were several other sporadic outbursts of fighting in what developed to be a disappointing game.

Although the Canterbury forwards had proved a point, their backs offered little of value, and defeat became inevitable as the second half wore on.

Some observers reckoned Canterbury’s efforts up front had merely stiffened the Lions’ resolve to succeed in the test series.

Lions manager Dr Doug Smith was astonished and dismayed that Vodanovich had used such a word as Passchendaele, but pledged the Lions would win the first test at Carisbrook by continuing to play the same type of rugby they had been producing on tour.

Vodanovich subsequently toned down his original wintry blast by promising that the All Blacks would not be fighting, kicking or punching in the test, but would play 15-man, clean rugby.

But although the All Black forwards were all over their rivals in the first half of the first test, the backs, as in Canterbury, never got into overdrive, and Barry John kept them continually back-pedalling.

The Canterbury game was not the only occasion on which the touring side encountered an antagonistic approach from the opposition. [i]And no-one was surprised either

The New Zealand Maori game was punctuated by some nasty flare-ups, one of which left Irish prop Sean Lynch with an injury to his mouth. It did nothing to improve his temper as the tour wound on.

And so up to "Hawkeye Country", where the Magpies had assembled a front row of former All Blacks Neil Thimbleby and Bruce McLeod, plus the hulking Hilton Meech.

A Hawkes Bay supporter entertained some members of the touring media with his special brew "Thimblemeech Cocktail," which, he assured the scribes, packed a real punch.

So did the front row. One of the merry trio whacked John Pullin, the Lions hooker, in the head, ending his football for the afternoon. The others enjoyed themselves by taunting Ian McLauchlan, the Scottish prop known as "Mighty Mouse," with cries of "how do you like that, Mickey Mouse?"

So who was to blame? Colin Meads, captain of New Zealand in his last year at international level, reckoned the Lions got away with "bloody murder".

He identified instances of Lions obstructing opposing jumpers in the line-out, also barging and blocking, and killing the loose ball.

Reduced well below his best level by bruised ribs in the Wanganui-King Country game, he lamented that his fellow forwards had let the Lions proceed unhindered. So did some referees. But he was sure that the Canterbury pack would not be so intimidated.

On the other hand, coach Carwyn James had insisted that the Lions forwards stay on their feet in rucks to facilitate a clean feed. Aware of the British habit of lying on the ball, he said he set out to insist on creative rucking, so that his talented backs could display their wares.
[/i]


Wed May 08, 2013 7:42 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Pinetree was outfought and he hated it.

First time for everything, Sir Colin.


Wed May 08, 2013 8:47 am
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
They need what was needed as they did in 1974 with the Apartheid loving mob.

Carwyn knew what to expect from the All Blacks and dealt with their thuggery handily. Carwyn's motto for forwards was to "get your retaliation in first".

I remember that game well as it was regarded as a disgrace to rugby at the time. Carmichael had a fractured cheekbone, and got punched more as he would not fight back. The referee watched and did nothing...a Kiwi, naturally..


Goann wrote:
The 71 Lions ranked right up there as right royal thugs.

Quote:
Battling the Lions: The battle of Lancaster Park
By John Brooks

It must surely rank among the most extraordinary and potentially inflammatory statements made by a national rugby coach.

After the ill-tempered game between the 1971 Lions and Canterbury at Lancaster Park, Ivan Vodanovich, chairman of selectors and coach of the All Blacks that year, warned the first test could develop into "another Passchendaele" for the tourists if they persisted in killing the ball in rucks and obstructing in the line-out.
His comments came after the Lions had beaten Canterbury 14-3 but had lost their two best props, Ray McLoughlin and Sandy Carmichael, through injury.

Carmichael sustained a multiple fracture of his left cheekbone and McLoughlin a chipped bone at the base of his left thumb. Both returned to Britain for treatment and recuperation.

McLoughlin’s loss was a serious blow to the Lions. He was not only powerfully built and vastly experienced but also a renowned tactician as befitting a man with the IQ of a genius.

It was a tribute to the tourists that they were able to win the series despite his loss.

In the 1966 game between Canterbury and the Lions, violence erupted in the first scrum. It had been rumoured that Howard Norris, a Welsh prop, had backed himself to knock an opposing forward off the pitch.

In the event, it was fortunate that it was not he who was carted off.

Fast forward to 1971, and we have Carmichael persistently boring in on Tane Norton, the Canterbury hooker, blocking his view of the ball entering the tunnel and, therefore, his heel.

Carmichael was warned twice by Alister Hopkinson, the opposing prop, but continued to infringe. He was punched more than once for his trouble.

Although the pudgy prop was in pain from his injuries, sources close to the Lions claimed that he was even more aggrieved to be called "a whinging Pom" by some louts on the embankment. He was proud of being Scottish.

McLoughlin was injured when players from both sides were flailing at each other near the embankment touchline.

The Irishman suffered a rush of blood to the head and punched non-combatant Wyllie in the head, breaking his left thumb. He merely proved what was widely known in Canterbury: that Grizz had a hard cranium.

Another Irishman, Fergus Slattery, was punched in the face after unwisely hanging on to Wyllie’s jersey in a line-out. There were several other sporadic outbursts of fighting in what developed to be a disappointing game.

Although the Canterbury forwards had proved a point, their backs offered little of value, and defeat became inevitable as the second half wore on.

Some observers reckoned Canterbury’s efforts up front had merely stiffened the Lions’ resolve to succeed in the test series.

Lions manager Dr Doug Smith was astonished and dismayed that Vodanovich had used such a word as Passchendaele, but pledged the Lions would win the first test at Carisbrook by continuing to play the same type of rugby they had been producing on tour.

Vodanovich subsequently toned down his original wintry blast by promising that the All Blacks would not be fighting, kicking or punching in the test, but would play 15-man, clean rugby.

But although the All Black forwards were all over their rivals in the first half of the first test, the backs, as in Canterbury, never got into overdrive, and Barry John kept them continually back-pedalling.

The Canterbury game was not the only occasion on which the touring side encountered an antagonistic approach from the opposition. [i]And no-one was surprised either

The New Zealand Maori game was punctuated by some nasty flare-ups, one of which left Irish prop Sean Lynch with an injury to his mouth. It did nothing to improve his temper as the tour wound on.

And so up to "Hawkeye Country", where the Magpies had assembled a front row of former All Blacks Neil Thimbleby and Bruce McLeod, plus the hulking Hilton Meech.

A Hawkes Bay supporter entertained some members of the touring media with his special brew "Thimblemeech Cocktail," which, he assured the scribes, packed a real punch.

So did the front row. One of the merry trio whacked John Pullin, the Lions hooker, in the head, ending his football for the afternoon. The others enjoyed themselves by taunting Ian McLauchlan, the Scottish prop known as "Mighty Mouse," with cries of "how do you like that, Mickey Mouse?"

So who was to blame? Colin Meads, captain of New Zealand in his last year at international level, reckoned the Lions got away with "bloody murder".

He identified instances of Lions obstructing opposing jumpers in the line-out, also barging and blocking, and killing the loose ball.

Reduced well below his best level by bruised ribs in the Wanganui-King Country game, he lamented that his fellow forwards had let the Lions proceed unhindered. So did some referees. But he was sure that the Canterbury pack would not be so intimidated.

On the other hand, coach Carwyn James had insisted that the Lions forwards stay on their feet in rucks to facilitate a clean feed. Aware of the British habit of lying on the ball, he said he set out to insist on creative rucking, so that his talented backs could display their wares.
[/i]

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Wed May 08, 2013 1:02 pm
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Post Re: Rugby Australia want a few major tweaks
Goann wrote:
The 71 Lions ranked right up there as right royal thugs.

Quote:
Battling the Lions: The battle of Lancaster Park
By John Brooks

It must surely rank among the most extraordinary and potentially inflammatory statements made by a national rugby coach.

After the ill-tempered game between the 1971 Lions and Canterbury at Lancaster Park, Ivan Vodanovich, chairman of selectors and coach of the All Blacks that year, warned the first test could develop into "another Passchendaele" for the tourists if they persisted in killing the ball in rucks and obstructing in the line-out.
His comments came after the Lions had beaten Canterbury 14-3 but had lost their two best props, Ray McLoughlin and Sandy Carmichael, through injury.

Carmichael sustained a multiple fracture of his left cheekbone and McLoughlin a chipped bone at the base of his left thumb. Both returned to Britain for treatment and recuperation.

McLoughlin’s loss was a serious blow to the Lions. He was not only powerfully built and vastly experienced but also a renowned tactician as befitting a man with the IQ of a genius.

It was a tribute to the tourists that they were able to win the series despite his loss.

In the 1966 game between Canterbury and the Lions, violence erupted in the first scrum. It had been rumoured that Howard Norris, a Welsh prop, had backed himself to knock an opposing forward off the pitch.

In the event, it was fortunate that it was not he who was carted off.

Fast forward to 1971, and we have Carmichael persistently boring in on Tane Norton, the Canterbury hooker, blocking his view of the ball entering the tunnel and, therefore, his heel.

Carmichael was warned twice by Alister Hopkinson, the opposing prop, but continued to infringe. He was punched more than once for his trouble.

Although the pudgy prop was in pain from his injuries, sources close to the Lions claimed that he was even more aggrieved to be called "a whinging Pom" by some louts on the embankment. He was proud of being Scottish.

McLoughlin was injured when players from both sides were flailing at each other near the embankment touchline.

The Irishman suffered a rush of blood to the head and punched non-combatant Wyllie in the head, breaking his left thumb. He merely proved what was widely known in Canterbury: that Grizz had a hard cranium.

Another Irishman, Fergus Slattery, was punched in the face after unwisely hanging on to Wyllie’s jersey in a line-out. There were several other sporadic outbursts of fighting in what developed to be a disappointing game.

Although the Canterbury forwards had proved a point, their backs offered little of value, and defeat became inevitable as the second half wore on.

Some observers reckoned Canterbury’s efforts up front had merely stiffened the Lions’ resolve to succeed in the test series.

Lions manager Dr Doug Smith was astonished and dismayed that Vodanovich had used such a word as Passchendaele, but pledged the Lions would win the first test at Carisbrook by continuing to play the same type of rugby they had been producing on tour.

Vodanovich subsequently toned down his original wintry blast by promising that the All Blacks would not be fighting, kicking or punching in the test, but would play 15-man, clean rugby.

But although the All Black forwards were all over their rivals in the first half of the first test, the backs, as in Canterbury, never got into overdrive, and Barry John kept them continually back-pedalling.

The Canterbury game was not the only occasion on which the touring side encountered an antagonistic approach from the opposition. [i]And no-one was surprised either

The New Zealand Maori game was punctuated by some nasty flare-ups, one of which left Irish prop Sean Lynch with an injury to his mouth. It did nothing to improve his temper as the tour wound on.

And so up to "Hawkeye Country", where the Magpies had assembled a front row of former All Blacks Neil Thimbleby and Bruce McLeod, plus the hulking Hilton Meech.

A Hawkes Bay supporter entertained some members of the touring media with his special brew "Thimblemeech Cocktail," which, he assured the scribes, packed a real punch.

So did the front row. One of the merry trio whacked John Pullin, the Lions hooker, in the head, ending his football for the afternoon. The others enjoyed themselves by taunting Ian McLauchlan, the Scottish prop known as "Mighty Mouse," with cries of "how do you like that, Mickey Mouse?"

So who was to blame? Colin Meads, captain of New Zealand in his last year at international level, reckoned the Lions got away with "bloody murder".

He identified instances of Lions obstructing opposing jumpers in the line-out, also barging and blocking, and killing the loose ball.

Reduced well below his best level by bruised ribs in the Wanganui-King Country game, he lamented that his fellow forwards had let the Lions proceed unhindered. So did some referees. But he was sure that the Canterbury pack would not be so intimidated.

On the other hand, coach Carwyn James had insisted that the Lions forwards stay on their feet in rucks to facilitate a clean feed. Aware of the British habit of lying on the ball, he said he set out to insist on creative rucking, so that his talented backs could display their wares.
[/i]

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