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Danny Wilson 
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Langland Exile wrote:
Back to the thread, Wilson's BBC clip was very telling. Clearly there is no money any more and it's hard to be associated with an organization with no ambition.


Even more telling was Gwyn Jones. The truth hurts and both JD and Ross Harries looked a bit uncomfortable at hearing his take on things at the Blues.


Sun Oct 01, 2017 6:52 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?
Yes I believe there will always be issues of sustainability. It may well be that there is room for only one sustainable region in the West and one in the East, and even then it will probably rely on support from individuals and businesses who are prepared to put cash into the teams.

The population within the Scarlets region in itself is way too small to fill the stadium. This is always going to be a challenge. The potential to fill stadiums (if you go by numbers of people withing travelling distance of the ground) is far greater withing Swansea, Cardiff and Newport. But these teams have never delivered significantly greater crowds in line with their population base.

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Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:31 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
I loved Gwyn Jones on scrumv. Jiffy wanted him to shut up because of their taffia boyo love in. As soon as this bs in welsh rugby goes then we can progress. There is a problem with the culture in the Blues - its people like Jiffy & Pieman who live in this little bubble of welsh rugby whereby they just go along and say yes because he's got lots of money and shitarses like Jiffy brown nose him.

I am not a blues fan, a welsh rugby fan and I can see the bigger picture. You dont have to be a *fupping* genius to see they are shite, shite, *fupping* shite!! Wilson has walked away before the toxic culture that is the Blues drags him down!! Its a poison chalice as long as they continue to have the same person controlling them.

Jiffy and the other arse lickers who sit in the club taking backhanders wont dare to challenge the culture because they are the culture!! Jiffy went North for cash and he would still go North for cash. Dont rock the boat folks despite the Blues sinking deeper and deeper into the mire. There has been no crisis down there - if there was we would have seen the change like they have had at the Dragons and the region taken off them. But even that speaks volumes as the WRU should have intervened by now - why havent they?

To be honest I thought the regions getting more cash would be a defining moment as they cannot blame anyone now - they got a better deal, central contracts and they still cannot deliver. For me this is endemic of the culture of the Blues and Ospreys - these teams dont become shit without reason - there is a reason and I have a hunch they are being wound down as the benefactors withdraw. I would love to be wrong but perhaps the honeymoon for the benefactors is over and they want their debts paid.

They wont get it back but also wont part with it which seems to me like an impasse with the players and fans suffering. I could be wrong, but the more questions we ask the more we will find out and I am sure there are people on here who know more about what is going on at these regions as welsh rugby is very insular and in some villages you cant shit without the street knowing and as we know in wales, we talk. So instead of being a squirmy little shit and being uncomfortable about the truth, lets be open, honest and go through the discomfort to get this resolved. I am a Ponty supporter and could claim a moral victory and say hurray the *bar stewards* have finally reaped what they sew, but I am a welsh rugby fan and would prefer to see four regions being competitive feeding a strong welsh xv than 1 region playing well and the other barely surviving.

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Sun Oct 01, 2017 10:51 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?

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Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:06 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.

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Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:31 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Langland Exile wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.


Except Northampton is 90 mins up the motorway for Quins fans, whereas Connacht is most of a day's travel and an Irish sea away.


Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:35 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Scarletrover wrote:
Langland Exile wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.


Except Northampton is 90 mins up the motorway for Quins fans, whereas Connacht is most of a day's travel and an Irish sea away.

you got it wrong the Quins fans fly up to Northampton by helicopter, unless they are guests at one of the local stately homes for the weekend, in which case they are given piggy-backs by the local peasants.


Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:54 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?

Leaving aside the oft repeated (by me :D ) but still relevant arguments of relative wealth and population for teams to draw on, it must be realised that Rugby just isn't that popular here any more. Football is by far the number one sport in terms of day to day interest and discussion. Those crowds ain't coming back any time soon.

The Ospreys had a world class team of superstars for several years, no club affiliation and sit in our 2nd biggest city. Their highest ever average gate for a season was 9488 back in 07/08 when the Swans were down in league 1 so no top flight soccer in town.

Most people's expectations of Pro Rugby attendances are simply unrealistic and based on 30 yr old memories rather than any real analysis of the market environment they operate in.


Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:58 pm
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Langland Exile wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.


And Worcester, Sale and Newcastle all got four figure attendance rates this weekend.


Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:03 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Langland Exile wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.

Northamptonshire has a population of 720,000 in an area much smaller than Pembrokeshire.

It has twice the population of Dyfed, all within 30 minutes of the town.

The Scarlets are punching well above their geographical and financial weight in terms of comparative attendance. It's very difficult to argue against that with any semblance of logic.

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Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:05 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
wasp wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?

Leaving aside the oft repeated (by me :D ) but still relevant arguments of relative wealth and population for teams to draw on, it must be realised that Rugby just isn't that popular here any more. Football is by far the number one sport in terms of day to day interest and discussion. Those crowds ain't coming back any time soon.

The Ospreys had a world class team of superstars for several years, no club affiliation and sit in our 2nd biggest city. Their highest ever average gate for a season was 9488 back in 07/08 when the Swans were down in league 1 so no top flight soccer in town.

Most people's expectations of Pro Rugby attendances are simply unrealistic and based on 30 yr old memories rather than any real analysis of the market environment they operate in.


Isn't it a basic truism in Wales that international rugby attracts more fans than international football (I am amazed at how low some of the crowds in the SH Rugby Championship are by comparison), but club football attracts more fans than club rugby? Moreover, at least in the big three towns in South Wales if not the smaller towns and villages, I think you'll find that has always been the case. Also, many people complain about how small Welsh regional rugby crowds are compared to Irish provincial rugby crowds, but (a) the provinces have long and ingrained histories and identities compared to the Welsh regions - 100 years more, in fact (b) they are generally more successful and (c) perhaps most importantly of all, rugby is probably the best paid and most prestigious team sport in Ireland - Gaelic sports remain strictly amateur and are not played much outside Ireland, while Irish domestic soccer is of a very very low standard.


Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:13 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
.....which is why some of us argued from the outset for more geographically delineated Regions in Wales, alas club and tribal bias prevailed and now we bear witness to the debacle.....

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Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:21 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Berlin Warrior wrote:
.....which is why some of us argued from the outset for more geographically delineated Regions in Wales, alas club and tribal bias prevailed and now we bear witness to the debacle.....

Geographical regions don't increase the population, or the interest in non international rugby. That's just propaganda put about by those who favour them over the current teams. There is no debacle other than a huge funding gap. As has been shown on countless occasions the 4 teams here do substantially better on the whole than Irish and English teams in terms of the share of population that engages with them.

The debacle is only seen in the eyes of those who would like pro-rugby organised differently. It's not apparent in crowds by any logical measure compared to our contemporaries in England and Ireland


Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:30 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
wasp wrote:
Berlin Warrior wrote:
.....which is why some of us argued from the outset for more geographically delineated Regions in Wales, alas club and tribal bias prevailed and now we bear witness to the debacle.....

Geographical regions don't increase the population


eh, I never mentioned a population increase, but what about an increase in supporter base?

West Wales with Os and *Terks* and Wizards etc fanbase
East Wales with Cardiff/Newport, Ponty/Bridgend etc fanbase
Mid and North Wales development Region.

Geographically delineated Regions would deffo have removed the tribalism and harmonised by locality rather than Club.

Anyhoo, it's to late to cry over spilt milk now, nothing has changed or will change.

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Mon Oct 02, 2017 12:57 am
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Post Re: Danny Wilson
Scarletrover wrote:
Langland Exile wrote:
Blindside wrote:
Dai Yorkshire wrote:
Blindside wrote:
ICEverything wrote:
Well you know me, if I've offended anyone's sensibilities then I would be the first to apologise. It's just that all this talk of Roger being right and regions going from 2 to 1 or whatever got me wondering about the old debates once again.



What the Scarlets have done is very impressive on the field, clearly, they have got something right, or perhaps i should say, many things right!

My question is this if they bring consistency of performance and quality of entertainment and still play to a half-empty stadium, to disappointingly small crowds, does it in itself highlight issues of the suitability of it as a "region"? Not trying to catch you out, honestly just thinking aloud with an open mind Rob?


A winning side is the first thing that is needed to draw crowds, The problem even a winning side has today is the variety of not just sports but other things that draw the crowds, Once you lose the crowds which rugby did in the 80s-90sit is very difficult to bring them back,
I am not the enthusiast I once was, Many of my friends say the same, are we now witnessing, " the beginning of the end "




Does not seem to be as much of a problem in England ?


Northampton drew 12,074 for their game with the Quins. Puts the Scarlets getting close to 8,000 (Fids :D ), into context.


Except Northampton is 90 mins up the motorway for Quins fans, whereas Connacht is most of a day's travel and an Irish sea away.


That was my point...

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Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:49 am
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