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Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues 
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Post Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
However poorly they have performed in the Pro 12 - which is the reason why they have constantly been in the Challenge Cup in recent seasons ever since the entry rules changed - according to the WRU site, they have actually been the most successful of the current four professional teams in the European Cup, with a winning ratio of 50% (compared with 44% for the Ospreys, 38% for the Scarlets and a mere 21% for the Dragons).
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/regions/statis ... an_cup.php

Let us not forget they very nearly reached the Final in 2009 had it not been for Martyn Williams' missed kick, then won the Challenge Cup the following year when it actually meant something and when Champions Cup pool runners-up like them could contest the Challenge Cup knockout stages. They also are the last Welsh region so far to reach the Champions Cup quarter-finals, back in 2012. Therefore, what explains their relative success in Europe compared to the other regions, especially the Ospreys, which is a team that has otherwise been more successful than them?


Tue Dec 13, 2016 4:16 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
najbritcol wrote:
However poorly they have performed in the Pro 12 - which is the reason why they have constantly been in the Challenge Cup in recent seasons ever since the entry rules changed - according to the WRU site, they have actually been the most successful of the current four professional teams in the European Cup, with a winning ratio of 50% (compared with 44% for the Ospreys, 38% for the Scarlets and a mere 21% for the Dragons).
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/regions/statis ... an_cup.php

Let us not forget they very nearly reached the Final in 2009 had it not been for Martyn Williams' missed kick, then won the Challenge Cup the following year when it actually meant something and when Champions Cup pool runners-up like them could contest the Challenge Cup knockout stages. They also are the last Welsh region so far to reach the Champions Cup quarter-finals, back in 2012. Therefore, what explains their relative success in Europe compared to the other regions, especially the Ospreys, which is a team that has otherwise been more successful than them?


Not sure about that, its always been the Mickey Mouse cup hasn't it?

Cardiff had a good side once Dai Young started to get his act together. They let him develop as a coach then he left, there's gratitude for you.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 5:05 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
John wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
However poorly they have performed in the Pro 12 - which is the reason why they have constantly been in the Challenge Cup in recent seasons ever since the entry rules changed - according to the WRU site, they have actually been the most successful of the current four professional teams in the European Cup, with a winning ratio of 50% (compared with 44% for the Ospreys, 38% for the Scarlets and a mere 21% for the Dragons).
http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/regions/statis ... an_cup.php

Let us not forget they very nearly reached the Final in 2009 had it not been for Martyn Williams' missed kick, then won the Challenge Cup the following year when it actually meant something and when Champions Cup pool runners-up like them could contest the Challenge Cup knockout stages. They also are the last Welsh region so far to reach the Champions Cup quarter-finals, back in 2012. Therefore, what explains their relative success in Europe compared to the other regions, especially the Ospreys, which is a team that has otherwise been more successful than them?


Not sure about that, its always been the Mickey Mouse cup hasn't it?

Cardiff had a good side once Dai Young started to get his act together. They let him develop as a coach then he left, there's gratitude for you.


In the old system, a team that won the Challenge Cup would either automatically be granted a Champions Cup place themselves (if not already qualified through their domestic league position), or would pass it on to the next-ranked team from their country. Also, as I explained, back then Champions Cup pool runners-up would be given a chance to compete in the Challenge Cup knockout stages instead, giving them a second chance. Therefore, it was taken more seriously back then.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:03 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
it was a good final too, Toulon kicked after loosing, Cardiff not so much after winning, the owner thought playing Billy Big Balls politics was more important

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:26 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Fids the Blindside wrote:
it was a good final too, Toulon kicked after loosing, Cardiff not so much after winning, the owner thought playing Billy Big Balls politics was more important


Yeah cos Boudjellal never mouths off or plays politics, does he? :D The only differences are (a) he has more money and (b) the FFR (at least until now) hasn't imposed anything like the kinds of restrictions on foreign players the WRU rightly does, which has enabled him to set up virtually a World XV.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:32 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:34 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other


Boudjellal has even threatened to take World Rugby to court over the issue of international player release. Say what you like about Thomas, but he is nothing like that nutty or obnoxious.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:39 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
err ewe rr en

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:15 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
najbritcol wrote:
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other

najbritcol wrote:
Yeah cos Boudjellal never mouths off or plays politics, does he? :D The only differences are (a) he has more money and (b) the FFR (at least until now) hasn't imposed anything like the kinds of restrictions on foreign players the WRU rightly does, which has enabled him to set up virtually a World XV.


Boudjellal has even threatened to take World Rugby to court over the issue of international player release. Say what you like about Thomas, but he is nothing like that nutty or obnoxious.


Get yr facts up to date Nai,

Ref yr comment above, the Jiff process has been going for years to reduce the foreigner presence (Toulon on w/end even had Toulon academy representation :D ) It has to be gradual and carefully worded because of employment law and precedence e.g Bosman et al

Boujellal has already taken WR to court in Marseille, the tactic has embarrased WR because now it is open to Country and EU laws. Its all about Article 9 ...and WR have now agreed to review it.

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:59 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Tony Panties wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other

najbritcol wrote:
Yeah cos Boudjellal never mouths off or plays politics, does he? :D The only differences are (a) he has more money and (b) the FFR (at least until now) hasn't imposed anything like the kinds of restrictions on foreign players the WRU rightly does, which has enabled him to set up virtually a World XV.


Boudjellal has even threatened to take World Rugby to court over the issue of international player release. Say what you like about Thomas, but he is nothing like that nutty or obnoxious.


Get yr facts up to date Nai,

Ref yr comment above, the Jiff process has been going for years to reduce the foreigner presence (Toulon on w/end even had Toulon academy representation :D ) It has to be gradual and carefully worded because of employment law and precedence e.g Bosman et al

Boujellal has already taken WR to court in Marseille, the tactic has embarrased WR because now it is open to Country and EU laws. Its all about Article 9 ...and WR have now agreed to review it.


I am not saying there aren't any homegrown players at Toulon, but it is not even remotely comparable to the Scarlets or Blues in this regard, and to insinuate it is is just funny. Like it or not, Toulon is known for Halfpenny, Nonu, O'Connor, Habana, Vermeulen, Gorgodze, Mitchell (although he was injured) etc. not for its academy.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:17 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
najbritcol wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other

najbritcol wrote:
Yeah cos Boudjellal never mouths off or plays politics, does he? :D The only differences are (a) he has more money and (b) the FFR (at least until now) hasn't imposed anything like the kinds of restrictions on foreign players the WRU rightly does, which has enabled him to set up virtually a World XV.

i
Boudjellal has even threatened to take World Rugby to court over the issue of international player release. Say what you like about Thomas, but he is nothing like that nutty or obnoxious.


Get yr facts up to date Nai,

Ref yr comment above, the Jiff process has been going for years to reduce the foreigner presence (Toulon on w/end even had Toulon academy representation :D ) It has to be gradual and carefully worded because of employment law and precedence e.g Bosman et al

Boujellal has already taken WR to court in Marseille, the tactic has embarrased WR because now it is open to Country and EU laws. Its all about Article 9 ...and WR have now agreed to review it.


I am not saying there aren't any homegrown players at Toulon, but it is not even remotely comparable to the Scarlets or Blues in this regard, and to insinuate it is is just funny. Like it or not, Toulon is known for Halfpenny, Nonu, O'Connor, Habana, Vermeulen, Gorgodze, Mitchell (although he was injured) etc. not for its academy.


I only addressed your out of date comments and corrected them ie Boudjellal / WR court action and the wrongly stated comment that nothing has been done to limit foreigner presence.

I think that you are in danger of straying from the purpose of this thread that you created if you continue tangential debate about Boudjellal and Toulon. It is significant that Cardiff beat Toulon on home territory and were worthy winners of the Challenge

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:24 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Tony Panties wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
Tony Panties wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Th French fella does both, Thomas stopped doing one to concentrate on the other

najbritcol wrote:
Yeah cos Boudjellal never mouths off or plays politics, does he? :D The only differences are (a) he has more money and (b) the FFR (at least until now) hasn't imposed anything like the kinds of restrictions on foreign players the WRU rightly does, which has enabled him to set up virtually a World XV.

i
Boudjellal has even threatened to take World Rugby to court over the issue of international player release. Say what you like about Thomas, but he is nothing like that nutty or obnoxious.


Get yr facts up to date Nai,

Ref yr comment above, the Jiff process has been going for years to reduce the foreigner presence (Toulon on w/end even had Toulon academy representation :D ) It has to be gradual and carefully worded because of employment law and precedence e.g Bosman et al

Boujellal has already taken WR to court in Marseille, the tactic has embarrased WR because now it is open to Country and EU laws. Its all about Article 9 ...and WR have now agreed to review it.


I am not saying there aren't any homegrown players at Toulon, but it is not even remotely comparable to the Scarlets or Blues in this regard, and to insinuate it is is just funny. Like it or not, Toulon is known for Halfpenny, Nonu, O'Connor, Habana, Vermeulen, Gorgodze, Mitchell (although he was injured) etc. not for its academy.


I only addressed your out of date comments and corrected them ie Boudjellal / WR court action and the wrongly stated comment that nothing has been done to limit foreigner presence.

I think that you are in danger of straying from the purpose of this thread that you created if you continue tangential debate about Boudjellal and Toulon. It is significant that Cardiff beat Toulon on home territory and were worthy winners of the Challenge


Yes, Cardiff beating Toulon in Marseille (part of Toulon's catchment) is indeed significant, although granted Toulon were not as much of a major force back then compared to now. Anyway, I just find it curious how the Blues actually have a better overall European record than do the Ospreys, even though it is received opinion that the latter is a rather more successful and productive team.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:29 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Cardiff have reached a final and a few semi finals (who can forget the infamous penalty shoot out)

The osprey's have never won a knock out game

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Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:42 pm
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
Fids the Blindside wrote:
Cardiff have reached a final and a few semi finals (who can forget the infamous penalty shoot out)

The osprey's have never won a knock out game


So the Blues are the least shit of the Welsh regions in Europe.

Congratulations to them, they must be so proud.

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Wed Dec 14, 2016 9:23 am
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Post Re: Curiously, the best Welsh team in Europe has been the Blues
touched a nerve I see :D

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Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:13 pm
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