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60 Cap Rule Announced 
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
spinbreath wrote:
I'm sorry, but Welsh rugby does not 'rely' on strong regions.
The Welsh regions have been largely crap during one of Wales' most successful ever spells at international level, and as far as the clubs lower down are concerned, the regions are entirely immaterial.
The regions should function as an integral part of the pyramid, but they've fought tooth and nail to prove they are independant entities. They value their own self importance far more highly than Welsh rugby, as do pretty much all the other clubs. There is no joined up thinking, there's only a shambolic frenzy of cat fighting.


It's all relative. We have had mixed results with Wales. We have had poor games against the southern hemisphere.

I fail to understand how a strong regional system won't improve the national game? Often we are low on depth.


Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:02 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Central Contracts.

No more PRW inspired NDC's, time for them to bite the bullet and say they were wrong to force them.

The debt is more than manageable but Wales must win and that stadium must be filled. They want more more money, its has to come in at the top and filter down.

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Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:41 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Cymru am byth wrote:
spinbreath wrote:
I'm sorry, but Welsh rugby does not 'rely' on strong regions.
The Welsh regions have been largely crap during one of Wales' most successful ever spells at international level, and as far as the clubs lower down are concerned, the regions are entirely immaterial.
The regions should function as an integral part of the pyramid, but they've fought tooth and nail to prove they are independant entities. They value their own self importance far more highly than Welsh rugby, as do pretty much all the other clubs. There is no joined up thinking, there's only a shambolic frenzy of cat fighting.


It's all relative. We have had mixed results with Wales. We have had poor games against the southern hemisphere.

I fail to understand how a strong regional system won't improve the national game? Often we are low on depth.

I don't disagree that a strong regional game won't improve the national game. I do disagree that Welsh rugby relies on strong regions.
I feel the two are not mutually exclusive.

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Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:43 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
spinbreath wrote:
Cymru am byth wrote:
spinbreath wrote:
I'm sorry, but Welsh rugby does not 'rely' on strong regions.
The Welsh regions have been largely crap during one of Wales' most successful ever spells at international level, and as far as the clubs lower down are concerned, the regions are entirely immaterial.
The regions should function as an integral part of the pyramid, but they've fought tooth and nail to prove they are independant entities. They value their own self importance far more highly than Welsh rugby, as do pretty much all the other clubs. There is no joined up thinking, there's only a shambolic frenzy of cat fighting.


It's all relative. We have had mixed results with Wales. We have had poor games against the southern hemisphere.

I fail to understand how a strong regional system won't improve the national game? Often we are low on depth.

I don't disagree that a strong regional game won't improve the national game. I do disagree that Welsh rugby relies on strong regions.
I feel the two are not mutually exclusive.


So what you mean is that we should have a strong regional game, but with the regions taking orders from the WRU rather than the other way round?


Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:04 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Ain't about taking orders, bro. It's about everyone working together to achieve the best result.

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Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:06 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
spinbreath wrote:
Cymru am byth wrote:
spinbreath wrote:
I'm sorry, but Welsh rugby does not 'rely' on strong regions.
The Welsh regions have been largely crap during one of Wales' most successful ever spells at international level, and as far as the clubs lower down are concerned, the regions are entirely immaterial.
The regions should function as an integral part of the pyramid, but they've fought tooth and nail to prove they are independant entities. They value their own self importance far more highly than Welsh rugby, as do pretty much all the other clubs. There is no joined up thinking, there's only a shambolic frenzy of cat fighting.


It's all relative. We have had mixed results with Wales. We have had poor games against the southern hemisphere.

I fail to understand how a strong regional system won't improve the national game? Often we are low on depth.

I don't disagree that a strong regional game won't improve the national game. I do disagree that Welsh rugby relies on strong regions.
I feel the two are not mutually exclusive.


I think we might be in agreement.

I think Wales have been a good team since the regions were formed. However, there are areas we can improve, not least by making the regions better and the system below it.


Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:19 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
As I have said before, the regions have enabled Welsh players to play in a more competitive environment than in the old club system and this has thus helped to improve the national team, even if the regions don't actually win that much silverware in their own right.


Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:41 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
najbritcol wrote:
As I have said before, the regions have enabled Welsh players to play in a more competitive environment than in the old club system and this has thus helped to improve the national team, even if the regions don't actually win that much silverware in their own right.


But there is room for a lot more improvement - yes?


Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:20 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Cymru am byth wrote:
najbritcol wrote:
As I have said before, the regions have enabled Welsh players to play in a more competitive environment than in the old club system and this has thus helped to improve the national team, even if the regions don't actually win that much silverware in their own right.


But there is room for a lot more improvement - yes?


Agreed. Incidentally, in recent weeks imo the Ospreys and Blues have been playing better than the results would suggest, and this is especially shown in the former's near-wins and latter's actual wins in Europe.


Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:58 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
We frequently get entertained by tier two Welsh rugby clubs many just amateurs. If more of our leading players joined English and French Clubs, it would hinder the development of their younger players, whilst our ex-pats would benefit from playing in a more intense atmosphere gaining inside knowledge of their national tactics. Professional rugby in Wales could then open the door to young developing stars.

Just make one demand for players going abroad; insist that their contract has a clause that releases them to the W R U at any time they are required during which time they will not be paid. If they do not have a contract so worded, then they do not deserve to play for Wales.


Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:09 pm
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
JOHNWALES wrote:
Just make one demand for players going abroad; insist that their contract has a clause that releases them to the W R U at any time they are required during which time they will not be paid. If they do not have a contract so worded, then they do not deserve to play for Wales.


George North has done that.

Do you remember what the end product of that was for Northants?


Tue Oct 24, 2017 9:55 am
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Haruki wrote:
A downside of this new ruling will be on dual qualified players. Using Moriarity as an example, if this rule had been in place 4 years ago I very much doubt he would have chosen to play for Wales knowing that it prevented him from having a lucrative career in England. I am sure given the same choice he would play for England. Tom Francis another example but also the next generation of dual qualified players such as Callum Sheedy, Mat Protheroe etc, are we almost forcing them to play for England?



Wow so just to emphasise the point i made above, according to this article there are 91 Welsh youngsters now playing in the English system because they are lured by education. Once they are in the English academies and possibly the age grade sides I am guessing it would have been a tough enough sell to get them to commit to Wales anyway but now we are going to tell them that they need to play for a Welsh region, at a lower standard of competition earning considerably less money until such a time as they have 60 caps!! I just can't see many of that 91 making the choice to do that if the alternative is a well paid career in the English Premiership? I fear that the WRU may have misjudged the value of the Welsh Shirt to these kids.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugb ... y-13800820


Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:30 am
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Haruki wrote:
Haruki wrote:
A downside of this new ruling will be on dual qualified players. Using Moriarity as an example, if this rule had been in place 4 years ago I very much doubt he would have chosen to play for Wales knowing that it prevented him from having a lucrative career in England. I am sure given the same choice he would play for England. Tom Francis another example but also the next generation of dual qualified players such as Callum Sheedy, Mat Protheroe etc, are we almost forcing them to play for England?



Wow so just to emphasise the point i made above, according to this article there are 91 Welsh youngsters now playing in the English system because they are lured by education. Once they are in the English academies and possibly the age grade sides I am guessing it would have been a tough enough sell to get them to commit to Wales anyway but now we are going to tell them that they need to play for a Welsh region, at a lower standard of competition earning considerably less money until such a time as they have 60 caps!! I just can't see many of that 91 making the choice to do that if the alternative is a well paid career in the English Premiership? I fear that the WRU may have misjudged the value of the Welsh Shirt to these kids.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugb ... y-13800820

Jesus. What a mess.

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Tue Oct 24, 2017 10:44 am
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
Haruki wrote:
Haruki wrote:
A downside of this new ruling will be on dual qualified players. Using Moriarity as an example, if this rule had been in place 4 years ago I very much doubt he would have chosen to play for Wales knowing that it prevented him from having a lucrative career in England. I am sure given the same choice he would play for England. Tom Francis another example but also the next generation of dual qualified players such as Callum Sheedy, Mat Protheroe etc, are we almost forcing them to play for England?



Wow so just to emphasise the point i made above, according to this article there are 91 Welsh youngsters now playing in the English system because they are lured by education. Once they are in the English academies and possibly the age grade sides I am guessing it would have been a tough enough sell to get them to commit to Wales anyway but now we are going to tell them that they need to play for a Welsh region, at a lower standard of competition earning considerably less money until such a time as they have 60 caps!! I just can't see many of that 91 making the choice to do that if the alternative is a well paid career in the English Premiership? I fear that the WRU may have misjudged the value of the Welsh Shirt to these kids.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugb ... y-13800820


and when further foreign fields and Academies beckon e.g France with obligatory parallel apprenticeships, scholarships, or formal training obligation and competitive wages beckon ....?

as already suggested with the Fijian Academies as a forerunner ... ;)

Glasgow's Mark Bennet joined the Clermont Academy but had a serious injury and subsequently went back to Glasgow .. there is precedence

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Tue Oct 24, 2017 11:42 am
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Post Re: 60 Cap Rule Announced
I read recently that Munster had 'poached' a duel-qualified Irish/Welsh youngster - guy's name escapes me at the moment - by promising and arranging either further education to degree standard or an apprenticeship leading to guaranteed employment, decent salary during training, accommodation, car etc. In short, taking care of every aspect to make the lad's life easier and more comfortable.

Can any of our Regions/WRU even begin to compete with that sort of package ?


Tue Oct 24, 2017 1:11 pm
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