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George North has another crashing fall 
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
flippin' heck


Thu Dec 15, 2016 6:34 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Fids the Blindside wrote:
flippin' heck
Makes you wonder if either the governing bodies or the clubs give a fupp for the players!

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Thu Dec 15, 2016 6:43 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
One has to assume Saints got this badly wrong. If they chose to deliberately ignore the protocols then someone should swing from the rafters.

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Thu Dec 15, 2016 6:46 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
That's been his view for many, many years.

Dr B O'Driscoll - a troubled man.

For 15 years the former Ireland full-back had been one of rugby union's insiders, and as a respected expert he sat on the International Rugby Board (IRB) medical committee.

He's been campaigning for better protection of players and resigned at the decision to trial a new protocol for dealing with head injuries, the Pitch-Side Concussion Assessment (PSCA) as Dr O'Driscoll saw the PSCA as poor practice.

The new protocol of Head Injury Assessment came into force in May, 2015 - http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/34606.php#.WFL7RTFvjcs .

George North came back to the rugby field in 6 minutes - that seems a trifle quick.


Thu Dec 15, 2016 9:26 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Bein' as 'ow it seems that the North injury saga is now to continue to next week, what is one supposed to make of this?

Going on for three weeks? Is the inquiry finding it difficult to find reasons to absolve Saints medical team? How much evidence is needed ffs?

A whole lot of facile explanations floating about. Medical team did what they thought was right according to their evidence (apparently they didn't see much of what the world and his uncle saw. Why not?). The argument that North knows better than anyone else his own body's reaction to being knocked out has to be, frankly, a load of blx. Last I heard he is not a concussion specialist and, quite obviously given his recent history, needs protecting from himself - and Northampon's medical staff.


Fri Dec 16, 2016 4:48 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
It sounds like there is a lot of conjecture from a lot of different people who feel that something should have been done DESPITE having no clue as to wether he was concussed or not.
He says one thing.
Other people say somehting else.
Neither can be certain.
Who knows what the real truth is.

Player welfare is obviously important.

For me - this incident highlights the fact that World Rugby has followed a path which they hope will allow them to mitigate liability, rather than a path which implements a meaningful Health & Safety protocol.


Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:40 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
welshy34 wrote:
For me - this incident highlights the fact that World Rugby has followed a path which they hope will allow them to mitigate liability, rather than a path which implements a meaningful Health & Safety protocol.


Possibly, snag is that the clubs in England only pay lip service to the improved protocol on the face of it.

If it is only lip service, that will not mitigate the clubs' liability.


Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:47 am
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Report on this being published tomorrow. ( Weds )

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Tue Dec 20, 2016 4:50 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
George North is set to return for Northampton on Friday, two days after the report into Saints' handling of his latest head injury will be published.

A concussion panel was set up after the winger, 24, played on after landing on his head in the loss to Leicester.

He was stood down after that game, but director of rugby Jim Mallinder said North has returned to training.

The final report will be delivered by the panel on Tuesday, prior to its full publication on Wednesday.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38383231


Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:21 am
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Bouch wrote:
welshy34 wrote:
For me - this incident highlights the fact that World Rugby has followed a path which they hope will allow them to mitigate liability, rather than a path which implements a meaningful Health & Safety protocol.


Possibly, snag is that the clubs in England only pay lip service to the improved protocol on the face of it.

If it is only lip service, that will not mitigate the clubs' liability.


Indeed :-)
I'm not suggesting it's real mitigation.

In fact - If I slapped George in the face and asked him how he felt, that would probably be about as useful as the current test. (as I understand it)

This incident demonstrates that despite APPEARING to be unconscious & FOLLOWING the protocol, he came back on and we STILL don't know if he was concussed.
For me - that means the process is flawed.

For me - World Rugby have responded to recent concussion litigation in NFL and have knee jerked a response & protocol because they felt they needed SOMETHING to try to stop that happening in rugby.

You only have to watch the process to know it's an absolute joke.


Wed Dec 21, 2016 11:17 am
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
welshy34 wrote:
Bouch wrote:
welshy34 wrote:
For me - this incident highlights the fact that World Rugby has followed a path which they hope will allow them to mitigate liability, rather than a path which implements a meaningful Health & Safety protocol.


Possibly, snag is that the clubs in England only pay lip service to the improved protocol on the face of it.

If it is only lip service, that will not mitigate the clubs' liability.


Indeed :-)
I'm not suggesting it's real mitigation.

In fact - If I slapped George in the face and asked him how he felt, that would probably be about as useful as the current test. (as I understand it)

This incident demonstrates that despite APPEARING to be unconscious & FOLLOWING the protocol, he came back on and we STILL don't know if he was concussed.
For me - that means the process is flawed.

For me - World Rugby have responded to recent concussion litigation in NFL and have knee jerked a response & protocol because they felt they needed SOMETHING to try to stop that happening in rugby.

You only have to watch the process to know it's an absolute joke.


Both sports are still so far behind where they should be.

The opening game of the NFL season Cam Newton was hit several times in the head, received no protection from referees and his team failed to check him for a concussion.

The only way around this is independent doctors on every sideline, and heavy fines/punishments for teams who don't help them carry out their work.


Wed Dec 21, 2016 11:54 am
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
TJP wrote:
Both sports are still so far behind where they should be.

The opening game of the NFL season Cam Newton was hit several times in the head, received no protection from referees and his team failed to check him for a concussion.

The only way around this is independent doctors on every sideline, and heavy fines/punishments for teams who don't help them carry out their work.


I'm not sure I agree.
I'm also not sure how an 'Independant' (good luck with that) Doctor can make a clinical assessment 'in the moment'.
For me - if you are making a clinical assessement - you are guessing.
I don't believe ANYBODY can make a reliably accurate clinical assessement of Concussion, in the moment, by talking to a player. (who might or might not be concussed).

The whole concept is a joke.
What they have actually done is formalised the existing old process i.e ..

Are you alright mate ?'
What's your name'
What days is it.
Can you walk straight.
Yep good to go.
etc etc

Basically they are talking to a player and if he looks, sounds and moves ok you are good to go.

Which is pretty much what we all did when I was playing.


Wed Dec 21, 2016 12:12 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Here's the decision ;


Quote:
Northampton Saints will not be sanctioned following the investigation into their treatment of George North's latest head injury, but it has been concluded that the Wales wing should not have returned to the field of play.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38391557

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Wed Dec 21, 2016 3:25 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
Llew wrote:
Here's the decision ;


Quote:
Northampton Saints will not be sanctioned following the investigation into their treatment of George North's latest head injury, but it has been concluded that the Wales wing should not have returned to the field of play.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/38391557


So another cosy little conclusion that means nothing to anyone and therefore *fupp* all will change?

They know how to look after their own!


Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:47 pm
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Post Re: George North has another crashing fall
welshy34 wrote:
TJP wrote:
Both sports are still so far behind where they should be.

The opening game of the NFL season Cam Newton was hit several times in the head, received no protection from referees and his team failed to check him for a concussion.

The only way around this is independent doctors on every sideline, and heavy fines/punishments for teams who don't help them carry out their work.


I'm not sure I agree.
I'm also not sure how an 'Independant' (good luck with that) Doctor can make a clinical assessment 'in the moment'.
For me - if you are making a clinical assessement - you are guessing.
I don't believe ANYBODY can make a reliably accurate clinical assessement of Concussion, in the moment, by talking to a player. (who might or might not be concussed).


The whole concept is a joke.
What they have actually done is formalised the existing old process i.e ..

Are you alright mate ?'
What's your name'
What days is it.
Can you walk straight.
Yep good to go.
etc etc

Basically they are talking to a player and if he looks, sounds and moves ok you are good to go.

Which is pretty much what we all did when I was playing.



Yes, but if the person is independent then the guess will err on the side of caution. Yeah it's hard to diagnose a concussion by talking to someone, but that combined with the footage from the match and the incident, which should be easily available in 2016 would allow the procedure to be safer.

If you look over at your sideline and Cam Newton is lying on the floor after taking a whack to the head, you shouldn't need to talk to him. It's a head injury.

If you see a player is down after a heavy fall and the replay shows he landed prone and face first like North did, then you don't risk it. He comes off.


Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:54 pm
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